Or maybe Fischer's detractors are not celebrating the disgraceful manner in which the USA treated the man who alone has glorified them by defeating the Soviet chess machine at the very heat of the Cold War?
@Former_Player Is it not possible that one would find the whole business of killing and/or disrespecting the dead to be a loathsome affair? Hence it is possible to find Fischer's remarks, the events of 9/11 and all varieties of war and violence to be offensive.
I think Bobby Fischer was right when he said chess was "played out", a contention made also by Capablanca. That's why players nowadays tend to quit in their early forties like Kasparov and Kramnik. In the top 50 of FIDE's live rating list there are only 5 players above the age of 40. That's ten percent. And some of those 5 are at least semi-retired like Svidler and Adams.
Chess has become a showcase for freaky prodigies who devote their entire lives to the game and generally burn out before they even hit middle age like Nakamura whose game has gotten a lot worse in the last 2 years.
Chess has become a showcase for freaky prodigies who devote their entire lives to the game and generally burn out before they even hit middle age like Nakamura whose game has gotten a lot worse in the last 2 years.
Fisher is one of my favorite players. It's perfectly possible to acknowledge his accomplishments and point out his flaws. One need not ignore his faults to respect his acheivements.
@Clutchnutz Perhaps this will give you some clue as to where the remarks by Fischer come from: timkr.home.xs4all.nl/chess2/pasad.htm
Is THIS how the state should treat its heroes? Was it followed by any kind of formal apology?
This is just one example. No wonder the great champion ended up hating his motherland - and he, unlike so many of his colleagues (let alone politicians!) who find hypocrisy and conformity totally acceptable, was a very frank and unequivocal person.
Is THIS how the state should treat its heroes? Was it followed by any kind of formal apology?
This is just one example. No wonder the great champion ended up hating his motherland - and he, unlike so many of his colleagues (let alone politicians!) who find hypocrisy and conformity totally acceptable, was a very frank and unequivocal person.
@Former_Player I am familiar with Fischer's life and his mistreatment by Pasadena police. I'm also aware of his arrest and confinement in Japan, which was likely related to his growing anti-American sentiment.
While I do think those incidents might have contributed to his intense distrust of American authority, I don't think it explains or justifies the celebration of the murder of thousands of people. Nor do I think it explains his obsessive hatred and disgust of people of Jewish faith.
Most of the criticism directed at him has not been about his dislike of the United States but his anti-semitic remarks and his celebration of the events of 9/11. I can't say that it seems reasonable that being wrongfully arrested and mistreated by police would cause one to form such opinions.
While I do think those incidents might have contributed to his intense distrust of American authority, I don't think it explains or justifies the celebration of the murder of thousands of people. Nor do I think it explains his obsessive hatred and disgust of people of Jewish faith.
Most of the criticism directed at him has not been about his dislike of the United States but his anti-semitic remarks and his celebration of the events of 9/11. I can't say that it seems reasonable that being wrongfully arrested and mistreated by police would cause one to form such opinions.
@Former_Player That said, I think it's far more likely that his anti-semitic, anti-American, pro-9/11 rhetoric was greatly influenced by years of immersion in the Worldwide Church of God, a sect of Christianity that was known for having a decidedly anti-semitic interpretation of Biblical scripture. There are plenty of people in the USA who have been mistreated by the police who haven't reacted by becoming anti-semites.
www.gotquestions.org/Worldwide-Church-God-Armstrongism.html
www.gotquestions.org/Worldwide-Church-God-Armstrongism.html
Absolutely he was a great person in many ways. The stress just broke him, although he was a little disadvantaged in the mental health area since youth.. (By 18 he was reading Mein Kempf and glaring at Reshevsky for being Jewish.)
I agree absolutely with the positive point of this thread. When we go into negativity, it usually just ends in posts and people who are always that way. Fischer wasn't perfect? Yes. Did he have love, kindness, compassion and many other heart felt qualities? Yes absolutely.
Things are never black and white. Bravo to the thread.
I agree absolutely with the positive point of this thread. When we go into negativity, it usually just ends in posts and people who are always that way. Fischer wasn't perfect? Yes. Did he have love, kindness, compassion and many other heart felt qualities? Yes absolutely.
Things are never black and white. Bravo to the thread.
@j234 I wasn't aware of him reading Mein Kempf so early in his career. Apparently his anti-Jewish views influenced him to get involved with the so-called Armstrongist philosophies of the Worldwide Church of God, rather than the other way around.
I also wasn't aware that he revered Nazism and was involved with white supremacist dogma in the early 1960's.
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/12/bobby-fischer-s-pathetic-endgame/302634/
He certainly was a flawed human.. but I agree, his humanity was still very much intact.
I also wasn't aware that he revered Nazism and was involved with white supremacist dogma in the early 1960's.
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/12/bobby-fischer-s-pathetic-endgame/302634/
He certainly was a flawed human.. but I agree, his humanity was still very much intact.
@Clutchnutz No one is perfect, so wasn't Fischer. You can't like everyone and everything; everyone is pro- and anti-something to some extent. These days, it doesn't seem a big deal to be anti-Russian, anti-Chinese, anti-Muslim, anti-Trump, anti-Christian, anti-communist, anti-capitalist, and so on. Let's say the Azeri and Armenian people (alas) predominantly consider each other worst enemies, which results in wars. Is it often that any person representing aforementioned examples is labeled crazy and lunatic?
Meanwhile if someone is openly anti-Jewish (sorry - antisemitic is a misleading term), or even hint at examples of Jewish misconduct (which happens because no one and no culture is ever perfect) - this person is instantly labeled 'crazy and lunatic'. That said, anti-Russian propaganda has been nearly official in the US media for years. Same in the Russian media about Americans (at least until recent years).
Are Jews the superior race here on Earth, whose culture and scriptures are flawless and are never to be criticized and discussed? Are they always honest or do they never commit crimes?
Should we really defame our greatest champions, scientists, musicians, composers, poets etc. just because they don't or didn't like Jews or let's say Armenians or Turks?
Meanwhile if someone is openly anti-Jewish (sorry - antisemitic is a misleading term), or even hint at examples of Jewish misconduct (which happens because no one and no culture is ever perfect) - this person is instantly labeled 'crazy and lunatic'. That said, anti-Russian propaganda has been nearly official in the US media for years. Same in the Russian media about Americans (at least until recent years).
Are Jews the superior race here on Earth, whose culture and scriptures are flawless and are never to be criticized and discussed? Are they always honest or do they never commit crimes?
Should we really defame our greatest champions, scientists, musicians, composers, poets etc. just because they don't or didn't like Jews or let's say Armenians or Turks?
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